“Isn’t it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too.” - Douglas Adams
I’m an atheist. I’d like to tell you why. Most of the arguments for being an atheist point to how it is more scientific or probable. I’m sure you’ve heard those before, so I’m not going to touch them. Instead, I’d like to focus on the reasons atheism can lead to a greater quality of life.
That said, I’m not here to convert anyone, just expose people to different ideas. I’m not on a crusade against religion. I’ve read many different books on various world religions. Even if I disagree with some of the founding points, the exposure to those ideas improved my philosophy towards life.
Common Arguments Against Atheism
I’d like to start by giving my rebuttal to many of the common arguments against atheism. I’m not even going to touch the circular logic of going to Hell or blasphemy. But here are some of the supposedly sensible objections to denying the existence of a god:
Morality
Morality doesn’t need to come from the threat of divine punishment. Religion can do much good, but it can be twisted to do evil as well. I believe ethics come from society. It comes from the basic principles of respecting the rights of others, service and altruism. You don’t need a god to explain morality anymore than you need Zeus to explain lightning bolts.
Afterlife
Another common objection is that in not believing in a god, you believe death creates infinite nothingness. I don’t have space to fully explain different theories on the life and death, but this doesn’t need to be so. Atheism only suggests that death is a current unknown.
Scott Adams suggested another possibility in his book God’s Debris. Your consciousness is based on a pattern stored on neurons in your brain. If this is the case, dying would simply pause the pattern and it would resume sometime in the future. With no delay being seen from the observer this would essentially mean you couldn’t experience death.
I’m not arguing that this theory is the way reality works, just that atheism isn’t surrendering to a nihilistic view of life. Instead, it is opening yourself to many different possibilities.
Meaning
This is an argument I’ve never quite understood. It basically goes that if you don’t believe in God, isn’t life meaningless? I think this is a rather weak argument since it assumes that meaning can’t be self-determined. It also assumes that without an invisible spirit watching you, life doesn’t have a purpose.
I pick a meaning for my life and I believe it is just as satisfying without conjuring a notion of a god. I believe a god can actually become a distraction from meaning since it causes you to focus on a divine overlord instead of what really matters – the other people and beings you share the world with.
Atheism for a Greater Quality of Life
Aside from being an atheist, I’m also a vegetarian. Beyond putting myself in two self-selected minorities, many of the arguments I’ve seen against vegetarianism are similar to those against atheism. A common cited reason people I know don’t want to eat meat is because they enjoy it too much. They don’t want to sacrifice.
This is hard to explain until you’ve tried both sides, but I don’t see avoiding meat as a sacrifice. Instead I see it as an opportunity to live a healthier life, reducing my chances of many chronic diseases and giving me more energy to do what I love. I also see it as removing the environmental and ethical discomfort in supporting an industry with questionable practices.
Similarly, I think a lot of believers don’t rationally believe in a god. But they don’t want to sacrifice the comforting notion that a being greater than themselves is watching down on them and helping them out.
But in focusing on that one benefit, you miss on the potential benefits of not believing in a deity:
- Freedom – The mental freedom to explore your world, learn and challenge your own assumptions. Instead of rejecting evidence that doesn’t fit your notion of a god, you can embrace everything with curiosity.
- Self-Reliance – Temporarily focusing on a god may keep you happy, but what about the long-term? Instead of expecting divine intervention to let everything work out, I focus on my own abilities and reasoning to improve my experience of life.
- Beauty – I believe beauty lies in the unknown. It lies in the things you can’t explain. That is what atheism really means. Instead of resorting to weak explanations of a deity creating the world, you see all the beautiful aspects of nature you currently don’t understand. Why tarnish evidence that the universe is larger and more magnificent than we ever realized by placing an invisible man in front of it?
Pantheism and Rational Spirituality
So far my arguments have been against the traditional notion of a god. That is an invisible, all-powerful being that not only created the universe but also, through conscious force, interrupts the rules of nature, that he himself created, to perform miracles for the benefit of one planet amidst billions of billions of stars.
The alternative to that doesn’t need to be a cold, hyper-rational, if-I-don’t-see-it-it-doesn’t-exist mindset. Pantheism (or as Richard Dawkins refers to it as “sexed up atheism”) is another choice.
Pantheism literally means “God is all.” It is the belief that the universe itself is god. That nature, humanity, science and truth are the reflection of god. In the most basic sense, this isn’t any different from atheism or science. But while atheism emphasizes what the atheist doesn’t believe in, pantheism presents the alternative.
I’m a follower of rational spirituality. Although it may sound like an oxymoron, rational spirituality means that truth, and your understanding of the world, enhance your appreciation of it. Instead of supplementing an unemotional scientific perspective with superstition, you find the emotional beauty in science and reason.
Read a book on evolutionary biology or quantum physics and it you soon realize how mind-blowingly amazing the universe actually is. The wonders of the New Testament, in my opinion, pale in comparison to how evolution works, the possibilities of string theory or quantum entanglement.
Appealing to a Higher Motive
God can serve a purpose in causing us to aspire towards something greater. But I don’t believe a theistic god is the only (or even the best) possibility here either.
Even beyond just appreciating nature and the world for beauty, you need an ideal to strive towards. A motivation that gives your life purpose and your broader actions meaning. An answer to the question, “What does it all mean?”
Finding your higher ideal is an incredibly personal task. It is a task that can’t be delegated or avoided by reading a holy book. I can’t tell you what your higher ideal should be. All I can show you is what mine is.
My higher motive is based on three separate principles:
- Truth - Complete understanding is the first part of my higher ideal. This means that there is intrinsic purpose in seeking the truth. And that faith or any suspension of the rational mind I possess is an inherent evil towards this goal. I don’t believe a lie at the most basic level can ever be superior to what reality actually is.
- Service – The second aspect of my higher ideal is service and morality. This means that there is intrinsic purpose in serving the greatest good and respecting the rights of others. Any act that harms the greatest good or infringes on the personal rights of another conscious being is inherently evil.
- Challenge - The final aspect of my higher ideal is that the pursuit of both truth and service is supposed to be challenging. Pain and struggle are not goals in themselves, but moving through challenges has intrinsic meaning if it moves you to greater truth and service. This means that no matter what happens to myself, there is a meaning in it if I choose to find it.
The two elements of rational spirituality and appealing to a higher motive do a far more elegant job of fulfilling me than adopting a specific religion and worshiping a god. Better yet, my beliefs are self-correcting. By placing the highest emphasis on truth, I am always willing to change my beliefs if evidence shows them to have errors.
Should You Become an Atheist?
I didn’t write this article to convert you. I fully expect not to have converted anyone who was already set in their beliefs. But just as I read religious and spiritual books to enhance my philosophy, hopefully this could do the same for you.
Further Reading for Atheism, Rational Spirituality and Higher Motives
Atheism:
- The God Delusion
- Letter to a Christian Nation
- God is Not Great
- The End of Faith
- The Blind Watchmaker
Science:
Spirituality and Philosophy:
- Buddhism Plain and Simple
- Tao Te Ching
- The Bhagavad Gita
- God’s Debris
- The Courage the Live Consciously (article)
I'm a speed-reading, vegetarian, holistic learning, productivity hacking university student.
Hey Scott,
You seem to be following a Hindustani lifestyle, from what I’ve read. Though you don’t follow the “practices” that Hinduism entails, Hinduism is more of a lifestyle rather than a Webster Dictionary religion, which means they are not vital to self-actualization. Read this article and tell me what you think: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1863/faq.
-Sudhakar
Hey,
On a somewhat of a tangent, I recommend reading the Upanishads as well.
Belief in God is a distraction only when we relegate God to something we think about rarely. We feel distracted from our ‘normal’ lives by our belief because we are forced to pause our lives once in a while to pay our dues to God by performing various acts of worship.
But if we develop an awareness of God every moment of our life and in every action, our belief is no longer a distraction. It becomes a way of life and God becomes a source of inspiration and enrichment in our lives.
It may seem more logical to believe there is no God. But once you find God you will be astonished as to how illogical disbelief is.
My intention is not to argue and to convince you that my point of view is correct. That is for you to discover for yourself.
I will merely urge you to have an open mind and do yourself the favor of taking the time to discover God.
I will leave you with a verse from the Quran where Allah (God) says
“We have not created in vain the heavens and the earth and
what lies between them. That is the fancy of the disbelievers.
But woe to the disbelievers in the fire of Hell. (Quran 38:27)”
Actually, I believe in God and I believe that this is my greatest motivation in life. But i also believe that it is important to respect what others believe in.
I just have some questions that I want you to ask yourself:
1- If I told you that I was standing on one side of a river and I wanted to pass to the other side but I couldn’t find a boat. Then, suddenly some long wooden bars in the water began to rise up in the middle of the river, these bars began to come close to each other, until they were all adjacent. Then, some ropes began to float on the water surface, too. These ropes came close to the wooden bars, and they began to wrap around the wooden bars, once, twice, more and more and finally these ropes made a knot and the wooden bars became very tightly coupled. Then, these bars began to move, and become closer to where I stand on the river side until they just stopped infron of me. and when I stood on them, they began to move me to the other side of the river until I finally arived safe there.
Would you believe me? Would you believe that all this happened without any human intervention? Just by nature?
I don’t think so. (although it is your right to do so)
If you find it difficult to believe this story, then how can you believe that the sky, the earth, all planets, gravity, seas, plants, animals, people were all created without God’s intervention?
How can you believe that a human had eyes to see with, ears to hear, mind to think, mouth to talk, let a side all nervous, digestive systems and many other things that a human has and that all these were only created by nature or by chance or whatever? How can you believe that all those wonderful things that science and research discover everyday are created without God?
I find my mind totally unable to disbelieve in god.
2- You said you have a meaning for your life without God. Don’t you think that every meaning in life can be destroyed by some bad circumstances that may happen? for example, a great scientist who is serving humanity may have a brain disease that destroys his meaning in life. A great athlete would be infected by a total paralysis that would totally hinder his movement and may never rise from bed again. Although these may seem extremes, but actually they happen. At this moment a person who does not believe in God loses every meaning in life, becomes a desperate person who thinks that his life is in vain. A believer in God knows that this is God’s will, a test from God, that although this is very difficult and hurting, but it deserves to be faced because heaven does worth and because he was created to believe in God and to love God and to do his best in life (as far as he can). This is the meaning of his life.
You might also find this useful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8b3wNXEyPA&feature=related
Nice chance to dust off the old communication skills
To be as frank as I can arguments that life has some inherent meaning have always sounded pathetically desperate to me. At the end of the day reem is right, some cataclysmic event can easily destroy that meaning. Life is just a painfully short thermal fluctuation in the background of an indifferent universe. It’s this uncaring nature of the universe that shows just how meaningless life is. This is something that’s obvious to all of us: You get into your car and you die on your commute to work, diseases of habits kill millions in the most advanced of nations and in some parts of the world child are born, live long enough to learn to cry out as they are swallowed up by diseases, huger and poverty. This solar system we live in is fill to the brim with rogue objects that could end all Earth on the planet in a matter of years. It’s almost sick to suggest that theres some meaning to life when we all descend from a group of possibly less than 5,000 individuals: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory
But at the same time, that also destroys the possibility of a God. The suggestion that a being exist with the power to mold a universe like the one we have, bring us into being and then sit back and watch us suffer is sick. If you tell me I’m too simple to understand his plan, I’ll tell you I’m complicated enough to suffer through it. I’ve got a marine buddy who I used to drink with and chat about philosophical whatnots. He was a deeply religious man and harbored an even deeper hatred for his religion. To him this world was so black that the only explanation for it was the devil. And of course that required a god to make him and give him Earth as his plaything. Saying that I exist to be some super-being’s plaything is the most nihilistic thing I’ve ever heard. I’d rather be chemical soup then a puppet on a string.
But you know what? I like being chemical soup. Just because I’m a thermal fluctuation doesn’t mean I don’t feel. Just because my feelings are just electrochemical processes doesn’t invalidate them. They mean something to me. I know that comes off as a nonsensical, psudo-recursive thing to say, but it’s true. I’m here. Tomorrow I may not be. You’re here. Tomorrow you may not be. And that’s it. We live, we die, but for the time being we’re here. I know a few things, some math and little science, I know my way around a computer. I know a little history and I’ve read a couple of books. But, the thing I know the best is that I don’t like to suffer. And I know that others are like me. I live here in this nice, advanced, western nation. Two generations ago my grandfather knew only of spirits and magic. He herded cattle. His son became a man of science and his grandson (yours truly) aspires to be an engineer. And this was all because someone in an advanced western nation was kind to them. Things done by people who came before me with the power to act who acted. That and the good fortune to be the ones they visited. We’re all like that: we benefit by the actions of those who came before us who had the power the act and the good fortune to have that power. And you know, in the future there will be people who will benefit from the hard work and luck of the folks right here in the present. And for me, that’s good enough. Making sure that they’ll have a future is all the religion I need. That and the opportunity to go to some third world mess of a country and be that nice westerner who gives them the chance at a better life so they can give someone a better future. Because I know they’re like me and they suffer and I can end it.
Sorry,I went off on a rant there. But all I was trying to say is that I don’t need a god or the need to convince myself that there’s some meaning in my life for me to go on or be moral. I could die tomorrow without accomplishing anything, I could die the day I get my degree or I could die after years of hard work and accomplishment. You’re going to tell me that my life would have been more valuable one way or the other?
Oh, and reem Stephen Hawking never quit even when he though he only had a year to live. He never accepted God nor did he ever stop working.
Sheefeni Hauwanga,
I just want to comment on your last sentence: “Stephen Hawking never quit even when he though he only had a year to live. He never accepted God nor did he ever stop working”
I will comment on this with the following verses from the holy Quran:
“Say: Shall We inform you who will be the greatest losers by their works? (103) Those whose effort goeth astray in the life of the world, and yet they reckon that they do good work. (104) Those are they who disbelieve in the revelations of their Lord and in the meeting with Him. Therefor their works are vain, and on the Day of Resurrection We assign no weight to them. (105) That is their reward: hell, because they disbelieved, and made a jest of Our revelations and Our messengers.”
Scott,
Your article is so very well-said and thoughtful. I too am glad to be one of the few who are free from the confines of a religion or a God. I am indeed a spiritual person, my belief is that all we have is here and now, and we need to cherish and appreciate it. Our most cogent proof for this, “humanism” is the feeling of satisfaction and joy we get from sharing time with another or helping a person in need. Forget about an afterlife – do something with your time now. As far as we know, that’s all there is.
It amazes me how so many people are willing to spend their entire life gambling on the bet that there is an afterlife – when not a single soul in the history of time has any proof. No one has ever come back and verified it. We’ve never seen God. If he exists, you would think we would have seen him at least once in history. Just once maybe he would have revealed himself to us.
But, as my father says – religion does have a purpose on this planet. It keeps the sheep (pun intended) in check. Their fear of an invisible being who can see everything they do, read every thought in their head and dangles the promise of an afterlife over their heads, keeps the majority of them from hurting others, doing evil, stealing my money, murdering my loved ones, etc. Fear is a great (and cheaply abundant) motivator, or should I say, policeman.
The questions I like to ask is:
Do you believe in something superior?
Do you always challenge your assumptions to get it closer to the truth?
Do you do your best to live accordingly?
If you answered YES to all the questions the rest doesn’t matter.
luizgpl @ hotmail . com
Greetings,
I really like these articles of yours, and I don’t believe in god, like scott said it limits your thinking to a one sided view alone, and I noticed most religion that has a god seem to be the source of arguements and discord, how foolish… ahahahah
Hey,
Just wanted to add my two cents. I too do not believe in an organised religion although I was raised catholic. I look at history and see religion perverted by those in power wanting to control the masses. I see churches begging for money, not necessarily to help others, but to build expensive buildings and to promote their social standing. However, I do believe in ‘God’ in the broadest sense of the world. The body is so amazing and complex and nature is so breath taking and powerful that it is impossible not to be filled with awe. To me that awe is a recognition of the divinity/magic/whatever you want to call it. I don’t mean that there has to be a supreme creator, but rather there is something more that I can not understand. I also noticed that religion seems to draw people apart and create divisions and I find that so appalling. Looking at how much we have in common with each other, with animals, and with nature how can anything that does not emphasis inclusiveness and connectedness be correct?
On another note, I am also a vegetarian. I would have never thought I could be a vegetarian (not that fond of veggies) especially for so long and not even miss meat. Most days it never crosses my mind that I dont eat meat. I find it irritating that people always think I did it because of animal rights (female vet student helps that image). I do have problems with the industry, but if that were my only concern I would find alternative local farmers or raise the meat myself. For me its about health, about the environment, about food shortages, and the fact that with so many alternatives why should I? I have never heard a successful argument for eating meat, never heard of a significant benefit only found in meat. And now I should probably get back to studying for my final tomorrow on the meat & dairy industry…
Nezzie,
Completely agree. Ethics were the last item on my list when switching to a vegetarian diet. However, after being vegetarian for four years, I feel the ethical argument more.
As for God, I define God fairly narrowly. If awe and wonder at the universe are included, then I suppose I’m a believer too.
-Scott
you really blew my mind here,
I have been searching to explain my thoughts about how a god could be present in this world, universe and by reading this article certain things became clear. I didn’t know there was something like Pantheism and yet when I read your explanation it represents my ideas.
Thank you for sharing these ideas!
(sorry if my english isnt so good but i hope you understand what i’m trying to say here)
‘I plan on writing a full article showing my view of rationality and the goal of a meta-philosophy (or a philosophy for how you handle your major beliefs). So I’m afraid I can’t offer much of a counter argument to that until I can write it in an article.’
I’m still waiting for this article
I believe I have an article entitled “The Virtue of Living Life Rationally” or something akin to that. Check the archives.
-Scott
“As for God, I define God fairly narrowly. If awe and wonder at the universe are included, then I suppose I’m a believer too.”
Scott,
You are so much more of a believer than you think you are! I really feel like a lot of people’s issues with God stem from the fact that they think God is a man sitting in a throne somewhere waiting to strike down.
God is energy. Perfect energy. Flowing like a river at all times.
If I can make one suggestion to you, if you haven’t already, read
“A Course in Miracles.” It was actually written by an Atheist and has brought more clarification to me then just about anything I ever learned under the roof of a church.
here’s a link http://www.acim.org/
And based on the majority of topics on your blog, it’s people like you who reinforce my believes about God! The love you share via your efforts to help people get more from life is a beautiful thing and a great example of God’s love.
Keep up the good work my friend!
Darren
You’re life will change once you stop searching for the god you want and you start searching for the God that is.
This is an interesting book Scott: Good Without God ~ What a Billion Nonreligious People DO Believe by Greg Epstein, Humanist Chaplain at Harvard.
I would like to thank you for posting this, it’s very insightful. I’m 18 and i’m trying to figure out if I do or do not believe in God. I go to a catholic high school so I hear many thoughts and arguments for God’s existence but not many sound thoughts of why he might not so i greatly appreciate you expressing your opinions. Thanks
@reem
Your false analogy, appeals to ignorance, false dichotomy, appeal to fear, and various straw men make for a very unconvincing and unappealing argument.
hi scott
re vegetarianism, you might want to consider the information in “the vegetarian myth” by lierre keith. most compelling pro-life pro-earth arguments against vegetarianism i’ve seen. (i was one). most immediately, my health improved quickly after altering my diet!
I don’t see why anyone would be so closed minded about God. Unless you know EVERYTHING, you can’t KNOW that God doesn’t exist.
It’s like this. To say there is gold in China, all I need to know is that one man in China has a single gold tooth. To deny that there is gold in China, I would have to know everything about China, and the possibility of gold being there…
I don’t believe in extraterrestrials, but I can’t say for sure that they don’t exist because I don’t know EVERYTHING. I don’t even know half of everything, but if I did, there’s still a chance that they could exist in the other half of knowledge that I don’t know about.
If there’s no God, who makes the rules? What if I decide that murder is ok?
I’ve learned a great amount from you through your blog, ebooks, etc. and really respect you in that sense, but I can’t understand how anyone could be so closed minded about God. He probably doesn’t believe in atheists anyway. I’ve been looking into this question quite a lot lately, and found this which I would encourage you to take a look at http://ecclesia.org/truth/atheist.html
The author, Ray Comfort, also wrote a very interesting book, “God Doesn’t Believe in Atheists” http://www.amazon.com/God-Doesnt-Believe-Atheists-Atheist/dp/0882709224
Joel,
I’m not close-minded at all. If I receive evidence of the existence of a higher deity (in the specifics claimed by world religions) I’ll update my probability of God’s existence.
We’re all agnostic about everything. It’s the matter of degree.
Darren,
I believe it’s important to clarify distinctions, otherwise words have no meaning. If God means whatever anyone wants it to mean, then the word is meaningless.
Adam,
I’m not sure the particular book you’re referring to. I can’t speak from that book, as the arguments haven’t been made to me. But most of the pro-ecological meat-eating alternatives are either broken arguments, or simply represent a reality we don’t live in (i.e. all pastured livestock, instead of factory farming). Vegetarianism, is a personal choice I wouldn’t thrust upon anyone, but there are few choices one can make that have such a large impact on ethics, environment and health with such clearly defined consequences.
-Scott
Hi Scott, you’ve made very good racional considerations. But in my opinion you forgot one of the most founding points in religion : how to handle the guilty. The concept of god is fundamental to clear the guilty. The guilty is a natural feeling that arise from the social living. From the moment you create emotional ties you create responsibility to the others. There is no rational relief for this, unless you think you would never make mistakes. Of course, there are many moments in our lives that the guilty simply dont exist. But when it appears , it can be so cruel, that no racional argument will relief tha pain. It happens because the chemistry of emotional aspects in our brain is predominant. When you are real sad, the racional arguments cannot help you so much.
Actually once a brilliant friend told me ” you know as the science progresses they will find and stumble one day on the existence of God”. I was reading “Brief History of Time” where there is still search of “Mind of God” or Universal Law combining the quantum and gravitational laws which he alludes to existence of God and famous “God does not play dice” phrase.
I asked one saint “Does animals go to heaven or hell?” He answered “I believe religion enforces morality as humans are only animals with the power to think and heaven and hell are created as God had given power of manipulation to them and will make them responsible for their actions.”
The day they resurrect a dead is the day religion will die.
P.S – Your books for reasoning seems like 90% of so called enlightened people read. You gotta read beyond the prescribed books as you have to seek truth outside the box . One tip is three major religions of the world – Christianity , Judaism & Islam have come from one region where so many prophets have been sent. Chinese and Indians did a great job transmitting philosophies but a bad job in defining the source of power which Buddha seeked out. Modern west intelligentsia seem to bash these religions cos of past history (church domination by corrupt ppl) and crusades (Islam – present problems and past history).
only 20% are right said by my guru the rest are seeking a shadow – I hated him when he said that but as I grow older I am seeing the trend.
reem, how is it not supremely unethical to condemn the majority of humanity to an eternity of torture?
Joel, I don’t think Scott is being closed-minded at all. The way I see it, taking the stand that it is no more likely that God does [i]not[/i] exist than he [i]does[/i] exist is just kowtowing to religion. I’ll take my view as an example: I’ve never seen even a shred of evidence for the existence of the supernatural, let alone a god. Therefore it is perfectly logical for me to believe that god does not exist. With that being said, as Scott said, I do admit the infinitesimal possibility that he does exist. But remember that this possibility is not any greater for God existing than Zeus, Thor, or Megatron.
Brian,
All hail Megatron.
-Scott
I really believe in God , and he is really exist
Does God Exist?
In this lecture Abdur Raheem Green addresses the age-old question, “Does God Exist?” The lectures begins by defining what a God is and continues to explore why it is common sense to believe in a Creator. He then brings forth the evidences from the Muslim Holy Scripture, The Quran, to detail the existence of the one true God.
http://www.islamhouse.com/p/289906
for more visit this site
http://www.islamhouse.com/s/9661
you need to search for the truth and then you will find it
thanks and good luck
Hello,
Can you just tell how the first living being was created?
[...] one of the least religious people you can find. I’ve never been to a church service in my life and I’ve never leaned towards a theological [...]
the ideas you have expounded are really inspiring.in my opinion,religion and god are two different things.god is eternal ,religion is not.men love to own territories.economic resources,and all what makes them the lords of the world,in the same vein they want to own god.jews say we are chosen of the god,christians believe that all is lie besides them and muslims think heaven is meant for them.they forget that god is the creator of all life.christ,moses,muhammad,budha,and krishna were the ray of beacon and inspired humanity when it had degenerated completely.church,mosque.temple are symbols,so instead of fingting for theses symbols ,we should respect and value one another .though iam a muslim but i think to be good human being is more important .
Everyone,
I’m joining this discussion rather late, so I hope this brings value to somebody.
I would like to comment on the “meaning” in life (or lack thereof). It is a common enough claim that life has no intrinsic meaning and that we are merely a random assortment of particles, etc. But if that is true, how would you know it? If there is no meaning in life, if you are merely a collection of atoms, how are you aware of it? The dog is not aware that it isn’t conscious. The dreamer (at least one who is fully asleep) is not aware that he is sleeping. If there is no meaning in life then we would have no way of knowing that. Sentience does not arise spontaneously.
This, to me, is a powerful philosophical argument for the existence of God. C.S. Lewis uses the metaphor of sleeping. If I am asleep, I cannot explain the waking world; all I am aware of is my dreams. If I am awake, I can explain my sleeping world; I know that I have had indigestion today, that I read a fantasy story, etc. If I am an atheist I cannot acount for science and art and culture, because we ought not be self-aware. If, however, I am a theist I am perfectly capable of explaining humanity’s powers of observation and creativity.
The same can be said of morality. It is true that religion and atheism both have produced morality. What the atheist must face, however, is the fact that according to his system of philosophy there ought not be anything such as morality at all. From where did humanity derive its ideas of right and wrong? We must recognize that – apart from comparatively minor differences – the major cultures of the world have a remarkably similar moral code. Where did this standard arise? From chance? But if that were the case we could not argue about absolute morality, there would be no uniformity of morals as we see today. God is the best explanation – not for the perpetuation, though that must be accounted for as well – but for the existence of right and wrong.
There are a multitude of other things to be said on the topic of God, but I will confine myself to these particular arguments. It is said in scientific circles that the best hypothesis is the one with the greatest explanatory power. It seems to me as if the existence of God can account for a great deal of things that are otherwise inexplicable.
Love,
Aidan
Scott,
1. Christians do not say morality comes “from the threat of divine punishment.”
2. Your second sentence, “Religion can do much good, but it can be twisted to do evil as well. I believe ethics come from society” is irrelevant to the discussion.
3. In asserting “ethics come from society,” you failed to demonstrate how this works or even address basic counterarguments. this is not a self-evident truth.
4. “It comes from the basic principles of respecting the rights of others, service and altruism.” Essentially, you are saying, “morality comes from morality.”
5. Your attempt at scoring points via emotion appeal is lame.
On the subject of morality, we would not be here if morality came from holy books and “gods” considering we’ve been evolving for millions of years and have been intelligent creatures for 100,000 years. Apes have morality, so do monkeys and birds and other pack animals, why? Do they have little holy scriptures written in Lionish that they go “oh I won’t kill the other members of my pride or else the god Simba will send me to lion hell!” nope sorry, they don’t kill each other because they survive better that way in packs… We are nothing more than pack animals, we don’t kill each other bc we survive better as a team! To say morality goes out the window without a god is supremely idiotic. The most peacefully and crime-free nations in the world are atheist nations. The most violent and dangerous? Deeply religious… Fact. Coincidence? I don’t think so. God is immoral and religion is evil, that’s my stance, it should be every intelligent person’s as well, if you can’t look at our history and see that religion is the root of all evil and a smokescreen for prejudice, rape, genocide, and racketeering then you are blind. We don’t need religion, we would have a much better world if it was religion free.
What if there really is a God?
I don’t know why the people believing in god always have to convince everybody of their view. Is it fear that they could loose their faith? Is it the feeling that people are attacking them when they tell them their view of the world? I don’t try to persuade anybody that there exists no god – why do they have to bother me? Telling me that there is a god and that I will go to hell if I don’t recognize that rather will make me hate religion than being open to it. Religion should be like eating habits: its my own business. If I go to hell – why is that the problem of anybody beside me? I think there is a believe in the christian tradition that only God should judge… But believing and acting are two different things, aren’t they?
If someone tell me that this world begin itself, without a creator, that is ridiculous. How something big like this universe created by nobody? How did the structure or generation of DNA occur? We can make an analogy. There is glass. I broke that glass. Who broke the glass? The answer is me. It is clear that every job done, there is someone who do it. Maybe if we ask scientist, how a DNA is created, he can answer it. But if we ask him, how a proton created, he will said,”Young man, that is not a question that falls within the realm of science.” Is it we called “science” when there is limitations–that science, in fact, strongly pointed to other explanations than natural ones to certain questions. Lord Kelvin, a very famous British scientist, described in his writings when he made the statement, “If you study science deep enough and long enough it will force you to believe in God.” . Finally you will say, “Yeah, atheism is not right choice.”
Hi Scott
FANTASTIC site, first time finding it. And very interesting article.
From Adian Clevinger, above: “If there is no meaning in life, if you are merely a collection of atoms, how are you aware of it?”
From GodBeliever above : “Lord Kelvin, a very famous British scientist, described in his writings when he made the statement, “If you study science deep enough and long enough it will force you to believe in God.””
The original post (above), and this response, are about God and not about any specific religion. And Scott to be honest I find you a not-too-convincing atheist, but I guess that’s probably based on my misinterpretation of the word.
To me, the following seems true:
- there’s so much we don’t know, that we cannot ever hope to disprove the existence of God.
- the entire universe is so beautifully intelligent, precise and intertwined that it seems ridiculous to attribute it to accident. Everything points to intelligent design.
- consciousness as a phenomena seems a little bit more than an in-brain electrical storm. With meditation, one can become wonderfully aware of the flow of thoughts. Who is this one within us?
It frustrates me that some people misinterpret the Big Bang theory and evolution as somehow proof that there is no God. That’s self-evidently weak to the point of triviality. What caused the big bang? What was happening before it? Who loaded the ingredients & set the timer, so to speak? And can we please accept evolution as being something that even a semi-intelligent designer would have built in LOL.
I believe it would be a trivial task to mathematically prove that we cannot DISprove God’s existence. That science or anything else can at best explain everything we can measure, see or deduce; but cannot disprove that more exists.
I further suspect, that with one important caveat, there must be a mathematical (i.e. logical) proof of the existence of God.
Not as a man-on-a-throne, and not (I believe) in any form that our language can ever fully communciate or our minds can understand. But I do believe however that God is very probably provable as a necessary concept that sits outside of our physical, space, time or string-bound reality.
But here’s the caveat. We will have no way of agreeing what that God is, even within the scope of that proof. He/she is technicolour, we’re colourblind.
Tophertron,
I hope this reaches you. You claim that atheist states are ipso facto the most peaceful, and that religious ones are the opposite. What about atheist, Communist Russia, which saw the deaths of several million people of faith, simply because they were people of faith? What about atheist China, which oppresses its people, suppresses their freedoms, etc?
My point was not that “holy books” give us morality. Yes, I do believe that the Bible is the only inerrant source of moral judgments, but most every person has a “moral compass” that tells them that their actions are right or wrong. What causes this moral compass? And furthermore, what OBJECTIVE standards are there for right and wrong? If you are an atheist, the answer to the first is “I don’t know”, and the answer to the second is “There isn’t one”. If humanity is a mere collection of atoms, if we are only chemical systems that have evolved over millions of years, then there cannot be any objective standard of what is right and what is wrong.
But history testifies that, to an extent, there is such an objective standard. The vast majority of cultures around the world, at all times, have subscribed to a remarkably uniform system of morality. How on earth does atheism account for this?
And, of course, we must remember this: perhaps we do not have to wonder if there are fairies in the garden. But it would be nonsensical to suggest that, somewhere, there wasn’t a Gardener.
Love,
Aidan
Sean,
I wrote this post a long time ago. The point I was trying to make wasn’t to try to argue all the reasons I believe there isn’t a god (which I believe are numerous and convincing) but rather to argue why I feel this proposition isn’t emotionally desolate, which many theists seem to claim.
I also don’t contend that the universe is accidental. But intelligence (which opens, rather than closes the question) isn’t the only resolution. I find it more compelling that the universe exists because that is the way it *must* exist (through mathematical proof) and not from an invisible man tweaking the knobs.
Although, I’m not here to really convert believers, merely to show my own thinking and learn from others. I appreciate the comments.
Beautifully written Scott. Your writing opens the debate wide enough to make room for all viewpoints to enter to feel welcome including my own. For myself I seek the language of the living spirit and what I mean by that is by comparison to the language of light best found maybe in the physics lab.
Were such a language of spirit articulated in a manner that could describe as with the properties of a spectrum in a beam of light, I wonder if in the language of spirit may be found as well…an intelligence?
For myself, to be honest I don’t know. I see God as the greatest stability amidst the greatest change. I can only believe it’s a possibility which beings me back to your written piece wherein as a believer in God myself I can’t distinguish where you and I differ as to morality but perhaps in only our choice of words and those as individuals with differing viewpoints to describe the reality of truth.
Best wishes
L.A. Russo
Interesting